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kiwi 
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 Topic: Z490 BuildPosted: October-09-2021 at 3:40pm |
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Hi Guys,
Just started to build a Asus ROG Maximus XII Hero (Wifi) with the ICUE H150I water cooler. Ran into a problem. The back plate supplied does not line up with the holes in the motherboard.They only talk about 1150 and 2011 sockets where as the 10900k is a 1200 socket.What goes,do i have to source another backplate but from where.The specs for the cooler say its compatable with the 1200 socket and all plates were included. Please help? Thanks Les |
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Donovan16
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Posted: October-09-2021 at 4:37pm |
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Hi Les,
Double check your backplate and positioning. Yes, the H150i is compatible with the 1200 Intel socket on the Asus Maximus Hero XII (wifi). Make sure you are using the correct backplate, as they also supply a backplate for AMX sockets in the package. Works fine here. Best, Don |
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kiwi
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Posted: October-09-2021 at 4:49pm |
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Hi Don,
Sorry my mistake, did not realize that the mounting holes are adjustable by a few mm. It now lines up fine. Les |
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Donovan16
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Posted: October-09-2021 at 5:25pm |
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Good to hear!
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kiwi
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Posted: October-11-2021 at 3:40pm |
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Guys,
I have the ROG Maximus Hero XII and was checking as to where i should connect the case fans to. I suspect they need to be connected to CH_Fan 1 2 and 3 or are these only for PWM fans.I am using a Fractal 7 which has its own hub with 3pin connectors. So if i use this hub fan speeds will be uncontrollable. They are not pwm fans.If i add a pWM then can be connected to H_amp. I should be then able to controll with Asus software. Is it still necessary to use Memtest v8.4 or can we use the latest to test memory. Thanks Les |
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Donovan16
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Posted: October-11-2021 at 8:58pm |
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PWM fans have four pins - non-PWM fans have three. Either can be used on the Maximus XII fan headers. Either fan can be speed controlled by software, just by different methods (pulse width modulation) vs voltage regulation -- the software will take care of it for you. You could instead set fan speeds/temps via the BIOS (I personally don't use this method.) I use the ASUS Fan Xpert 4 software to control my fans -- all are non-PWM, without a problem. That is the only portion of the Asus AI Suite 3 software that I use.
PWM fans can be more finely controlled to slower speeds than non-PWM, I have found this to be a non-issue in my builds. The H150i manual does specify which header to use for the AIO pump, I don't recall off the top of my head, and I use the iCUE software to control the pump based on coolant temps. All other fans I base off the CPU package temp. My fans are 0.30 amp fans, so I do have a splitter for the 3-fans on the top of my case, blowing hot air out, which run just fine as they pull in total less than the 1 AMP rating for the individual header. (pg 1-9 of the Maximus Hero XII user guide.) and they never have to run at full speed at all and the fan noise is not noticeable except when I was doing initial thermal stability tests and the speeds increased so they were kicked up to fairly high speeds. In actual simulation they are not noticeable at all. On the Memtest86 -- the version I know is tried and true for the outlined Hardware is v8.4 -- I'd have to read the User Guide on the newer version for its hardware supported. Probably the newest version is just fine, but at least I _KNOW_ version 8.4 is compatible and reliable. Best, Don |
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kiwi
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Posted: October-12-2021 at 5:23pm |
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Hi Don,
Thanks,the H150i Pump Tach goes to the CPU_Fan header. Re the other fan connections, i was not sure if the motherboard fan headers were speed controllable.I will use Ch_fan 1 -3 for my case fans. Can you give me a link to Memtestv8.4. All i can find is either their latest version or v4 which they list as their older version. Les |
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Donovan16
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Posted: October-12-2021 at 9:40pm |
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Les,
The current free version 9.3 from the author's site is fine. I'm running it now on another PC putting it through the paces. |
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kiwi
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Posted: October-13-2021 at 3:56pm |
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Thanks,
Will download it now. Best Regards Les |
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kiwi
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Posted: October-20-2021 at 10:13pm |
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I have just updated the bios to 0607 and in Nicks guide hes says
"CRITICAL: When the BIOS is first booted on the first BIOS enter screen when prompted be sure to HIT F3 to “UNLOCK LIMITS FOR INCREASED PERFORMANCE” F3 is the Favourites menu, am i supposed to see other options to select or is he saying by hitting F3 you have automatically unlocked any Limits. Thanks les |
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Donovan16
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Posted: October-20-2021 at 11:30pm |
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On the first boot on the new bios, an initial small options screen should have come up that asks that question. Its only given once, thereafter it won't show. Don't select the "load with optimized settings" option. You must select the F3 from that screen.
You can press "Clear CMOS" button on the back panel, and it will clear the settings and should give you a fresh BIOS on the next boot, and you'll start again from scratch. Best, Don |
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kiwi
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Posted: October-24-2021 at 4:20am |
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Thanks Don,
I just did not read the first screen properly.All ok now. Les |
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kiwi
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Posted: November-02-2021 at 9:04pm |
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Hi,
I am having some difficulties in finding the P/S fan adjustment in Icue v4. I did come across it but now cant find it. Thanks Les |
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Donovan16
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Posted: November-03-2021 at 12:05am |
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Did you click on the graphic of the Corsair H150i on the top border of the main menu?
This opens a popup with options of Lighting Effects, Hardware Lighting, Cooling, Alerts, and Device Settings. Select Cooling and another popup menu will open. Press the + button and add a Custom Cooling Preset. You can create your custom cooling curve there. I'm on a different computer, but if you need a screen shot or two I can do that later. I think Nick posted some screen shots -- try an advanced search and see if you can find his post on this. Don |
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kiwi
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Posted: November-03-2021 at 12:13am |
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Hi Don,
Yes i can get to that point but isnt the H150I the AIO cooler?. I want to be able to control the Power supply fan(HX1000). Nick indicates in his Bible that the fans are set in Icue. I have been able to do the H150I ok. Thanks Les |
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Donovan16
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Posted: November-03-2021 at 1:09am |
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Ahhh! Not all of the Corsair PSUs are ICue controlled. Mine (AX860) is not and it is dedicated single rail.
From what I see under the technical specs for the HX1000 on Corsair's website, it is also not ICue controllable. Its been a non issue for me, even with the RTX 3090 onboard. Don |
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kiwi
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Posted: November-03-2021 at 5:15am |
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Thanks Don,
Could not see anything in the manual but thought i would ask. I have another question,i have got to the stage to start the 5gig stage step 6. After setting up the bios and booting into win10 all ok. However after about 1hr the system is locking up. I have not tried adjusting anything but assumed at this starting point it would be in its most tame state and would be quite stable. Am i wrong or do i have something else amiss. My memory in memtest past ok.It had been quite stable untill adjusting bios for 5.0gig test. Comments on this would be appreciated as i dodnt want to go on if there is something fundamentally wrong. Thanks les |
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Donovan16
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Posted: November-03-2021 at 11:34am |
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Hi Les,
This doesn't mean anything is fundamentally wrong! It only indicates that in the present state one of the key voltages is too low. This is where the fun begins. Since you didn't post any voltages and the VID I assume this is just the base starting point, and no tests were being run? The system was just sitting idle for an hour, then locked up? What does VID display at in HWMonitor with your starting point voltages? You will adjust your Offset Voltage in the BIOS by 0.010 until the VID is at the target value of 1.315. A screen shot of HWMonitor would be helpful here. Don |
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kiwi
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Posted: November-03-2021 at 5:43pm |
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Thanks Don,
Looks like i have some work to do. Started the test and Linpak running my cpu temps after 5min were 83c. Is the stock heatsink compound that comes with the H150i alright to use . That is what i am using and i think the cooler is installed corectly. Les |
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Donovan16
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Posted: November-03-2021 at 7:42pm |
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Yes. The thermal compound Corsair supplies with the H150i is actually quite good. As long as the AIO's head is tightened properly and making good level contact with the CPU heatspreader cap. Screws are hand-tightened with fingers only (no pliers!) but as snug as your fingers and thumb can make them. Tightened as changing a tire -- i.e. tighten opposite screws and work around evenly so the unit is tightened onto the CPU evenly. Your temps are a bit higher than mine were on the trials for CPU:Linpack at 5.0 GHz but well below any Danger Redline. Size of your case, orientation and number of fans, ambient room temperature all can influence temps. For 5.0 GHz my temps averaged 75 degrees (max was 78), on 60min CPU:Linpack. Don
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kiwi
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Posted: November-03-2021 at 9:56pm |
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Don,
i have it running now for 30mins and the left hand column sits at 80c.Most of the cores sit at about mid 70s but three seem to be 80c. I noticed occasionally the cpu reads 54c and then will pop up to 74c. Whats happening here. I still see the clock freq of 5gig.My ambient temp is 68f and the case i am using is the same as Hans(happyflyer) is using with nothing in the case. I wound up the radiator fans to extreme which helped.I noticed there is some heat comming from the GPU and its fans are not running. I am using a RTX3070. Are you using something like after burner to control gpu fan speed. Thanks Les |
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Donovan16
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Posted: November-03-2021 at 11:17pm |
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Yes, I use MSI Afterburner to set up my GPU fan speeds and monitor GPU temps. Since you are really using minimal graphics power while running these tests its not surprising that the fans are not doing much, but the fans should be running.
On HWMonitor what are your GPU temps? GPU fans speeds? For example, right now just using my browser my 3090 is running at 29 deg C, and each of the two GPU fans are running at 1005 RPM. Also, what is your pump speed on ICUE? (mine is running 2336 as I type) Don |
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Donovan16
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Posted: November-04-2021 at 12:06am |
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That sounds pretty typical, I have about 3 cores that run a bit hotter over time. All cores vary in the transient temps moment to moment.
The CPU package temps will jump 20 deg C on CPU:Linpack? Holy smoke! <= [EDIT] False Alarm. My temps can jump up transiently up to 4 degrees but 20? Something does not sound right here. Sounds almost like air bubble circulating or some intermittent pump failures like bad connection/wires. It should NOT being doing that. What is the AIO pump speed in ICUE? Don |
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kiwi
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Posted: November-04-2021 at 12:54am |
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Hi Don,
Pump speed in ICUE is 2353 as i have it set as Balanced. Finished testing both Linpak(79c) and CPU(68c) and all passed. My GPU temps in Hwmonitor are 41c and speed is 0. I dont have after burner installed. Yes it is worrying re the CPU temp in Linpak.I will check wiring. Any other things i could do.Its a closed loop so i cant do anything re bubbles can i. I will run Linpak again tomorrow and see if the same behaviour is noticed. Thanks Les P.S Could it be the cpu sensor on motherboard at fault? |
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NickN
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Posted: November-04-2021 at 8:24pm |
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Its fine
OCCT Linpack and CPU go through a series of both full-on loads and also throttles backs for short periods, then reloads the CPU, and repeats during each test... normal. although I agree it appears to be up there in max temps during the two tests @ 5.0... As was stated, the final temps of any system will depend on the tower ambient room temp, the tower fans/circulation (make sure the tower fan curves will run 100% fan @ 70c in the Asus Fan Xpert software and Corsair radiator fan curves are set to run 100% when liquid temp in iCUE reaches 38c), the proper flat liquid head connection to the CPU (you can place a slight torque with a screwdriver on each of the liquid head screws, but be gentle) and finally the CPU itself and the lid to CPU die contact underneath the lid as well as how flat the lid itself is to the liquid head. After loading a CPU down it is possible the thermal pad relaxed a touch (it melts) so giving the 4 screws on the liquid head a little torque with a screwdriver may be needed. Use a X pattern, one corner screw, then opposite corner, then above and across, for equal torque. |
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Donovan16
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Posted: November-04-2021 at 9:21pm |
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There you go! I stand corrected, and a good catch indeed!
Completely my error as I had switched up in my mind CPU:OCCT and CPU:Linpack (the latter is the AVX set test.) Last night I ran CPU:OCCT for 60 minutes and saw a max of 4 degrees jump transiently, before I responded. YES, on CPU:Linpack the usage/temps jump up as Nick says. I apologize for any cardiac arrests I may have been responsible for.....   Don |
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kiwi
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Posted: November-04-2021 at 9:44pm |
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Thanks Nick,
Tried your suggestions but no luck. Today my temps are now in the mid 80's. Which way round are the H150 cooling fans supposed to go.Blowing cool in or sucking hot air out. Currently i have cool air being blowing into the case. Thanks Les |
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Donovan16
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Posted: November-04-2021 at 9:58pm |
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I have my radiator mounted on the front with the three fans drawing in cool air. Three case fans at the top, blowing hot air out, two on the bottom side pulling cool air in, and the last fan at the rear blowing hot air out the rear. All but the radiator fans are controlled with the ASUS FanXpert4. The radiator fans are controlled with ICue software.
Hans has his radiator on the top blowing hot air out. -- Don
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kiwi
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Posted: November-04-2021 at 10:37pm |
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Thanks Don,
i have just turned the fans round so i am now blowing hot air out. Just running the test now. Les P.S Turned my fans around and now get between 75 to 79 during Linpak. Its interesting,that throttle back i get seems to ocurr every 8mins for about 1.5mins.I think i can live with that temp range. Cant go any higher for clock speed cause the room i use gets quite hot in Summer. |
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Donovan16
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Posted: November-05-2021 at 1:37am |
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Glad to see those temps fall back into a more expected range! That is normal on the Linpak (AVX) test. Its actually not "throttling", its how the OCCT test is designed, but I understand your description perfectly.
It's your call and your investment. But, as you are no longer in the mid 80's temps at 5.0 GHz, I don't think its a great risk to give 5.1 GHz a try. Do set your Thermal Limits as described in the outline. Even if you decide to take what you have and quit at this point, you can have the satisfaction that 5.0 on all 10 cores is a good solid performer and I think you will be quite happy with it. During the time I was initially setting up my system and running the test trials, my air conditioning went out on a hot day here in southern California. Normally my ambient room temps are 78 degrees F, but they were in the high 80's - mid 90's that day. Yes, my CPU package temperatures on the trials DID raise a few degrees C over what I had been seeing on the earlier trials. Lastly though, I do have some attention on those GPU fans. Let me know what you do / find out regarding them. Best, Don |
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kiwi
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Posted: November-05-2021 at 4:50am |
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Hi Don,
Thanks for the comments,i have installed after burner and my gpu temps have dropped about 8 degrees.I have yet to do HCI Memtest and HT,thats tomorrows job. I will try for 5.1 and see how far else i can get and if it gets to hot and instability occurrs i can throttle it back. Les P.S How many threads should i run in Memtest Pro. |
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Donovan16
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Posted: November-05-2021 at 7:31pm |
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10 threads = one per physical core in non-HT testing. Uncheck the [] Low priority threads as you are running the test by itself, not otherwise using your computer while the test is in progress. It takes a while if you are testing 32 GB of ram -- I typically let it run overnight while I slept, as there was no point in watching the display. I think for most of my tests I ran 1200% - 1500%, sometimes longer but 800% is a minimum. When testing w/ HT enabled I ran 20 threads, one per logical core. I am not sure if that is necessary, but since we must run all logical cores on OCCT:Linpack x64 when testing with HT, I did the same on the HCIMemest when stabliity testing with HT enabled. Best, Don |
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kiwi
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Posted: November-05-2021 at 11:43pm |
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Thanks
Regards Les |
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kiwi
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Posted: November-07-2021 at 12:17am |
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Don,
What temps do you get with 5.1 and 5.2 with and without HT. Thanks Les |
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Donovan16
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Posted: November-07-2021 at 12:56am |
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Hi Les,
No HT HT 5.1 GHz CPU: Linpack 64 Temp: 78 (32-81) 60 (29-79) CPU:OCCT Temp 78 (30-81) 63 (29-76) 5.2 GHz CPU:Linpack 64 Temp: 78 (32-81) 69 (30-85) CPU:OCCT Temp: 59 (31-64) 68 (29-86) I can guess your next question....  Why are the temps lower with HT enabled than without HT? The OCCT Linpack test wasn't designed to stress test CPU HT capabilities. The actual threads are running spread across the logical cores of 20 vs 10. This is strictly a stability test with the AVX-1 instruction set for CPU heat and with the memory in play. That does not mean that when running "real life" applications or a simulator that is coded to take full advantage of HT, that you won't see the higher temps. OCCT CPU is about overall CPU stability alone. Best, Don |
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NickN
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Posted: November-07-2021 at 11:35am |
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He also analyzed his rig for optimal air flow. In his case he found drawing air in with the radiator on the front on the tower (cant remember if he runs a side fan) and evacuating out the top/back, the best way to go for his. Your mileage may vary In my case (no pun intended) I found it best to have the radiator on top, evacuating air through it out the top with the 3 radiator fans, a large front fan for intake (230mm as I recall) at the bottom/front, a very large side door fan intake (230mm) and a 140mm rear fan (exhaust) Been using the same tower for over 10 years HAF 932 | Cooler Master however I did change the fans out for higher velocity/quieter run. Its in the HASWELL ON AIR thread.. tower hasn't changed, just added the radiator to the top. I also maintain a room (actually entire house) climate control of 78F with a humidity of 38-45% year round with little change. (unless the little ho's who are tending to me are messin with my house climate controls - I'm not up and around right now)  There is no set temp range although someone can look at a result and suggest there may be an issue, there is no way anyone can tell you what temp will be what you should see for any CPU speed,.. unless an expert is sitting in the room and looking everything over in order to make suggestions for changes. Last You can not blow anything up as long as: You set the BIOS up as defined which included a thermal limit in the CPU settings You set OCCT to shut down at the defined temp setting outlined in the document If those are set.. you can whack it to the wall and if the temp limits are reached, software or BIOS will stop the carnage with ZERO DAMAGE. That's why I set it up that way! Idiot proof, which included myself  On the flip side.. you may be getting closer to your TOWER WATT LIMIT on temps on OCCT:LINPACK due to the AVX code hit. I CLEARLY explain that in the document and there is a setting you will make once you start hitting the max TEMP limits by observing the WATT LOAD@ MAX TEMP That's something Don did not explain.. he has a WATT LOAD LIMIT SET and I do not know if he is hitting it (he would have tell you that) and his system is somewhat throttling @ 5.2 It may not hit the limit on his! But others MAY Just because you throttle some @ 5.2 by using WATT LOAD LIMITS, doesnt mean you cant run 5.2 You must very well understand that these load test are far harsher than anything you will ever throw at the tower in NORMAL USE. You are simply finding the highest stable limits with safety protocols being added and put in place as you go. Your tower will never hit what LINPACK or HCI on memory load tests will do to it carry on
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kiwi
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Joined: February-10-2003 Location: NZCH Points: 193 |
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Posted: November-07-2021 at 2:18pm |
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Hi Nick,
Thats a pretty good summary. Was going to ask the questions you have already answered. Yes i found having radiator fans as air out gave me best results. I notice all my fans are air out. Thats how the case fans were set. Do think redoing cpu thermal paste would help. I noticed when installing heatsink, to me seemed there was to thicker layer of it. I know my temps at 79c are a bit high but i do want to try and see how safely high i can go. Good to know if my safety net is correct then i cant destroy anything. Don:Thanks also,you also answered one of my questions on HT temps. Thanks Regards Les |
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Donovan16
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Posted: November-07-2021 at 3:15pm |
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Just to fill in any blanks, as given in the Overclocking the Z490_10 Guide, I originally started with the 9700 OCing guide, so I had already set up my thermal limits and safety net (283w,284 w). But by the time I was at 5.2 I had never hit the power limits set, and my temps never came close to max limits. As Nick said, I did a LOT of homework in choosing my case and fans and setup -- time that was well spent.
Also the truth of the matter is that we set this up with a relatively early release of the 10900K and I was lucky enough to get a good CPU slug (Not a "Golden Chip" but very good,) and a good quality run of the Motherboard production. On the two trials I just posted the temps from, my max power draw was 251w on the CPU:OCCT at 5.2 GHz: VCore 1.359 (0.746-1.421) Pwr 219 (10.3-251) Temp 68 (29-86) IA 0.963 VID 1.469 (1.145-1.470) VCCIO 1.200 (1.168-1.200) VCCSA 1.200 (1.168-1.200) Before locking things down after fine-tuning the system, we did set the power limits lower for for added safety and longevity: Long Duration Package Power Limit [254] Package Power Time Window [2] Short Duration Package Power Limit [255] By this time I had run upwards of 50-60, and likely near almost 100 trials as Nick provided guidance and I simply painted the strokes under his tutelage. As we tweaked the process throughout all those trials I never hit those power limits (never hit 254w or 255w in HWMonitor unless those spikes were so transient that it was never picked up by HWMonitor,) and by that time had a solid database of data points showing just how my particular system acted. It is possible that there was some throttling by the setup scaling back a bit with the OCCT:Linpack at 5.2 when the AVX instruction set was sensed though, but I don't think so. As has been pointed out by Nick, every system is individual. Best, Don |
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i9 10900K 5.2 GHz, ROG Maximus Hero XII, RTX 3090, 32 Gb GSkill TridentZ 4000 15-16-16, 1Tb Samsung 970 EVO Plus, 2Tb Samsung 860 Pro SSD, (2) 2 Tb WD 7200 HDs, Corsair H150i, Win10 Pro x64
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kiwi
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Posted: November-07-2021 at 4:35pm |
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Don,
Thanks, tried for 5.1 but temps are max 91c.Wonder if i tried redoing the thermal paste would help. When i installed the cpu it looked like a lot of paste had been applied. All my fans are as Nicks so maybe 5.0 is all i am going to get. Regards Les P.S i used the same case as Hans.Even installed a 200mm fan in the side. |
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Donovan16
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Posted: November-07-2021 at 5:13pm |
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I'm sure you've read this thread, but you might want to re-read it about pg 15 or thereabouts.
Like I said, 5.0 MHz on all 10 cores is not a bad deal, but I understand wanting to see if you can get all the performance you can get safely and sanely. Best, Don
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i9 10900K 5.2 GHz, ROG Maximus Hero XII, RTX 3090, 32 Gb GSkill TridentZ 4000 15-16-16, 1Tb Samsung 970 EVO Plus, 2Tb Samsung 860 Pro SSD, (2) 2 Tb WD 7200 HDs, Corsair H150i, Win10 Pro x64
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kiwi wrote: