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watt load with HT ON / OFF OC guide Z490

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Driver170 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Driver170 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: watt load with HT ON / OFF OC guide Z490
    Posted: August-10-2021 at 10:30am
I just completed the 5.0 profile and now moving on to HT enabled and just finished both OCCT tests and now doing the memtest pro.

Regarding the watt load with the AVX will i go by the watt load with the HT off profile which was 209.25W or will i use the watt load with OCCT LIN test with HT=ON

Thanks

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote deviantdog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-10-2021 at 9:33pm
You should have two separate profiles, a NO HT profile and an HT profile. In BIOS, I set the "safety net" watt limit for each of my profiles based on the maximum temperature and watt load readout during Linpack tests for each profile. 

Remember also, at 5.0 you may not be seeing temperatures that would require a watt limit to be set in BIOS. I didn't have to set a limit until my 5.1 overclocks. What are your temps at 5.0?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Driver170 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-11-2021 at 2:21am
Hi,

That’s me fully completed both profiles for 5.0 just need to do that 3D graphics step 9 and also lower the offset voltage for both profiles later.

My max Temp for the CPU was 85c and max watt was 209.25 - This was for HT=OFF

The package temp was in the mid 80s and the core temp was between 80-90. Seems quite high?

I will have to rerun 5.0 with HT=ON to get the temp again sorry. But i did notice the CPU and package temp was much lower though.

Nick does mention in his guide that if we observe high 80s temp we can stop here and apply +10 watt

IF your system is displaying MAXIMUM temps between 85c - 89c during 5.0GHZ OCCT:Linpack testing and lets assume for this exercise the MAXIMUM watt load displayed is 220 watts (or whatever it displays for that CPU temp range). You will ADD 10 watts to that maximum displayed watt value. Enter the BIOS and make the following changes:

NOTE: If the maximum CPU temperature is 90-93c THEN ONLY ADD 4 watts to the Maximum watt load displayed in HW Monitor x64 and input as shown below.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote deviantdog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-11-2021 at 8:55am
Ok, so based on the temperatures and maximum watt load displayed on Linpack for your 5.0 NO HT clock, I would set:

EXTREME TWEAKER/INTERNAL CPU POWER MANAGEMENT MENU 

Long Duration Package Power Limit [219]
Package Power Time Window [2]
Short Duration Package Power Limit [220]

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Driver170 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-11-2021 at 11:56am
Thanks i will apply that later. I will also need to run OCCT Linpack for 30 mins to get max cpu temp and watt load also to apply + 10W

For offset Voltage i’m running - 0.045 and have max VID 1.315 now. All 3 tests are complete with HT OFF can i now start increasing the offset voltages? So 0.050 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote deviantdog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-11-2021 at 12:27pm
I don't entirely understand your question. If you are changing offset again, you would need to test again, as when you change voltages, your numbers will change. If you have passed your Linpack, CPU and Memtest at 5.0 NO HT with an offset of -0.045, you can reduce your offset to -0.050, but you would need to run all your tests again to see if the tests pass. Your watt load may also be affected by the change
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote deviantdog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-11-2021 at 1:08pm
Respectfully, it sounds like you may be jumping around a bit. Nick has created a guide that when followed step by step can yield awesome results. If you are not following the steps, you are setting yourself up for failure and the potential to damage your system. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Driver170 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-11-2021 at 1:34pm
Hi, sorry if i sounded like i’m jumping about but i’m not. Regarding your first reply that is now my aim is to start reducing the offset voltage and re run all tests, LIN, CPU and memtest.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NickN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-11-2021 at 2:43pm
You stated here:


Originally posted by Driver170 Driver170 wrote:

I’m currently on HCI memtest pro. Just completed 5.0 ghz OC with HT = OFF

My Vcore was 1.20 roughly throughout. Temps were mid 80s for the package and some cores hit 90c. So that’s me locked at 5.0 after memtest etc.

My BIOS offset voltage was 0.060 initialy but had to change this to 0.045 to get 1.370 in the MAX column.

is that 0.060 or -0.060?      is that 0.045 or -0.045?

You posted your voltage resulted in a VID of 1.370 above which isn't correct for a 5.0 clock. 1.315 is the starting VID to test and you find the correct offset voltage to hit that target as outlined in the guide. 

In this thread you said your VID was 1.315 with a offset of - 0.045v 

Which is it?!   I think that might be where the flippin around is coming from and it can confuse the issue and the advice as well as the result.


It was clearly stated in the guide to start with a offset voltage of (MINUS) -0.060 and look at VID with a small load then adjust from there. 


You are into clocking again and when it comes to this subject and posting information, if you are looking for assistance for a guide that is very clearly outlined you best make sure the information you post here is spot on accurate or the advice you get may be skewed due to your poor descriptions and reports on what you are doing. 

This is nothing to screw around with.

The advice you received above from DD is correct ASSUMING the voltage information you posted is correct on load tests AND you passed all the load and memory tests.

IF SO you can then drop the offset voltage as was suggested above and retest all, (VID will drop with it) and then do it again if you pass the next voltage drop. When it fails, raise the offset voltage back to the last successful run.

On top of that, if you are DROPPING voltage for testing, then you DON'T set your WATT LIMITS till you FIND your lowest stable voltage, THEN USE the watt load and TEMPS from the LAST SUCESSFUL TEST to set the watt load limiter value. 

That value may also be tweaked as you move up in CPU speed and TEST.

This is all in that guide. 

HOWEVER, when you report one thing in one thread and turn around and say something in another when asking for assistance, you run the risk of getting good advice ASSUMING what you say is right. But if it isn't, you run the risk of getting BAD advice based ON YOUR REPORTS.

This is overclocking and if you screw this up, you bought it. It will not be any forum members responsibility for the advice they may give if there is a loose nut behind a keyboard and it isn't properly tightened up, FIRST. 

I don't need a response.

You guys can carry on.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Driver170 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-11-2021 at 3:02pm
Hi Nick,

Damn ! It was a Typo, sorry guys. It should read 1.315 and -0.060
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NickN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-11-2021 at 3:11pm
Originally posted by Driver170 Driver170 wrote:

Hi Nick,

Damn ! It was a Typo, sorry guys. It should read 1.315 and -0.060



That's not what you said above!!

Are we mixing up RIGHT AND LEFT AGAIN?



Originally posted by Driver170 Driver170 wrote:


For offset Voltage i’m running - 0.045 and have max VID 1.315 now. 

TYPOS LIKE THAT IN THIS SUBJECT CAN BE DEADLY

GET YOUR ACT TOGETHER PRIVATE PYLE OR...


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Driver170 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-11-2021 at 3:13pm

Get the fk off of my obstacle. Get the fk down off of my obstacle. Now. Move it.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Driver170 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-11-2021 at 3:16pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NickN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-11-2021 at 3:19pm
Originally posted by Driver170 Driver170 wrote:


For offset Voltage i’m running - 0.045 and have max VID 1.315 now. All 3 tests are complete with HT OFF can i now start increasing the offset voltages? So 0.050 

THATS DECREASE THE VOLTAGE FROM -.0450 TO  MINUS -0.050 PYLE, NOT INCREASE! AND CERTAINLY NOT TO 0.050!

DONT DUCK WITH ME PYLE!


You confuse everyone when you post your 'typos' I'm amazed you haven't confused yourself!

GET IT RIGHT!



When you get it right and say it right, you might get some reasonable help, otherwise folks read what you post, scratch their heads and don't want to RISK your confusion for their legitimate assistance and reputation.

Other folks read these threads too and when they see things like that they might do what YOU posted thinking it is right and POOF!

Of course that's their problem but I don't like that kind of crap in this forum

Get it?

PROOFREAD YOUR POSTS AND MAKE SURE THE INFORMATION AND THE QUESTIONS MAKE SENSE.



Carry ON

I need a Xanax now. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Driver170 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-11-2021 at 3:33pm
I really need to be careful with my typo. But in no way would i jeopardise my system. I have been double checking everything and reading twice with the guide. I also never assumed a setting last night and searched google and this forum to find my answer.

 IF SO you can then drop the offset voltage as was suggested above and retest all, (VID will drop with it) and then do it again if you pass the next voltage drop. When it fails, raise the offset voltage back to the last successful run.

On top of that, if you are DROPPING voltage for testing, then you DON'T set your WATT LIMITS till you FIND your lowest stable voltage, THEN USE the watt load and TEMPS from the LAST SUCESSFUL TEST to set the watt load limiter value”

That is understood. I will drop my offset voltage by 0.003. So will now be -0.048 and test with OCCT LIN until it fails and raise it back up. Then move onto OCCT CPU…

I do have a question. Can i drop the offset Voltage with my HT ON profile first?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NickN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-11-2021 at 3:45pm
Originally posted by Driver170 Driver170 wrote:


I do have a question. Can i drop the offset Voltage with my HT ON profile first?


Can you make a shoe smell?



 

Wait.. let me take another pill and wash it down...








































gULP!


















SURE! You can do it ass-backwards if you like. But it has to be fully retested with 5.0 NO-HT anyway, so you're not saving any time or gettin around any testing thare Skippy, have fun. 


You are also SAVING 2 separate BIOS Profiles, one for 5.0 No HT and one for 5.0 With HT and EACH may run a different offset/VID. 

Skip all you like! You ain't gettin there any faster or any easier.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Driver170 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-11-2021 at 3:51pm
I will Keep HT OFF and start to decrease my Vcore. Would i be OK to use 0.005 for the offset drop.

“To speed things up you could try dropping offset by .005 at first and if that passes all the tests again I would say that would have a good influence on temps and watt load. If it doesn't pass then try a smaller amount like .003”

VID has dropped 1.310V and temps are already lower - CPU max 84c and Package 86c

I suppose like stated in your guide lower voltages will bring the temp down Ie from -0.045 to -0.050
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NickN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-11-2021 at 4:00pm
YOU CAN DROP IT BY -0.010 or -0.020 if you like!  

Say take it from -0.045 to -0.065

You can go WAY DOWN and starting coming up. Just depends on where you want to start playing

You are GOING DOWN in voltage, not up. Why would you need to ask? Are you afraid a LOWER voltage will OVERHEAT your processor or OVERDRIVE your watt load?



See, this is EXACTLY WHY I suggested you don't screw with overclocking a long time ago, and you said you wouldn't.

Well, here we are. I knew you were full of it when you said that and that you were going to do it anyway!   

Just don't mess with this forum or members here positing 'TYPOS' or asking questions that don't make SENSE


Past that, have fun!






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another Xanax?,    ahhhhh   common,  pleeeease?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Driver170 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-11-2021 at 4:07pm
I do remember i did say i wanted to get a good clock on my new rig that i spent a few bucks on and i WOULD be fully responsible if i fry it.

I wouldn’t screw with the BIOS if it wasn’t for your Guide to be fair Nick. I would accept the stock clock and my 10 core processor with the RTX3080ti than go on to YouTube!

Bloody hell that is true. Lowering your Vcore will not increase Temp Embarrassed

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Driver170 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-12-2021 at 1:18pm
Hi, currently on 5.0 profile. Started off with -0.045 and now have slowly moved on to -0.060 but have a slight query…

I set Offset Voltage to -0.060 and performed OCCT LIN with no errors, BSOD or freezes. So i moved on to and performed OCCT CPU which completed after 1hr. However, this froze my PC once the test was complete at 1hr? So i’ve gone back to -0.055 which was stable and all three tests complete.

Should i try -0.058 by decreasing the offset voltage by -0.003

What does this hang mean? Maybe i’m very CLOSE to my voltage?

Cheers
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Driver170 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-13-2021 at 2:18pm
Today I finished my 5.0 OC profile for HT OFF. I then moved onto 3D mark test and installed the latest version. The test complete fully with the score and no errors, but my system completely freezes / hangs. So I changed my offset voltage from -0.058 to -0.055 and still it froze on both cases at the end.

Any suggestions 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Driver170 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-13-2021 at 3:29pm
Dropped my offset Voltage back to -0.045 and no more freezes.

Time Spy Score was 17279

So how come OCCT LIN / CPU / Memtest pro never picked up this instability? Now i need to stick with -0.045 and VID 1.315
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Donovan16 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-13-2021 at 9:19pm
Originally posted by Driver170 Driver170 wrote:

  So how come OCCT LIN / CPU / Memtest pro never picked up this instability? Now i need to stick with -0.045 and VID 1.315

These basic truths existed when Nick first posted this and are as true today as then, and will be true from here on out when it comes to overclocking:

Haswell and Overclocking 107:

Am I Finished and Stable?

 
 
 

If you have gotten this far then of course congratulations are in order! The question now is: Is your system stable?

 
Maybe!  Possibly NOT!
 

In the FSX bible I specifically warned that installing Windows and loading the initial drivers and software in a clocked state is UNWISE and should never be done. I also warned that installing large amounts of software into a new highly clocked system can present issues down the road you cant see now but end up pulling your hair out trying to find a problem later.

There is a reason for my assessments and recommendations. With a new system and a new clock setup you are probably not 100% stable and simply don't realize it. People follow a guide, run stability tests and ASSUME too much as well as take very BAD advice on the internet. That goes for the guide I have outlined here.

I stated earlier in the thread: THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS 100% STABLE when we are talking high-end clocking. We can establish a setup that has a 'HIGH PROBABILITY' for being very stable but the fact remains that the system is overclocked, factors change over time, and, as such we are running outside of any engineering specifications that define lab tested stability.

 
THEREFORE: Until such time as we have:

A: Load tested a system for days (usually 2 or more) without stopping the load test and have passed.

And/Or

B: Worked with the system for weeks, usually a month or more, and have found NO crashes or stability issues related to being overclocked

NEVER ASSUME THE SYSTEM STABILITY LEVEL.

Keeping consistently updated image backups during the initial run time with a new system and clock is a very good way to avoid disasters.

Once 'B' has been accomplished, then the 'assumption' of system stability becomes relevant, not until. It is at that point where we can then do things such as uninstall/install large amounts of data, perform system maintenance and other tasks while the system is clocked, but even then under no circumstances do we ever install Windows and initial drivers/software in a clocked state.

 
Further...

Lets assume we have passed many weeks of use with no issues, is everything stable?  Well, environmental factors can and do CHANGE during the course of time. Dust in the system, increases in ambient temperatures during the year, hardware can be stressed and weakened whereby a module or a chip could start to display signs of stability issues after being clocked for many months.

 
So I will repeat this again:

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS 100% STABILITY WHEN WE CLOCK A SYSTEM. PLEASE REMEMBER THAT. I hope I have made this point very clear.

 
 
Over time even if we do not see issues the system should be cleaned as well as seasonal load test checks should be performed to confirm ambient environment temps have not altered the result. Even with stable temperatures periodic load test should be performed to confirm our hardware remains stable and break-in or burn-in periods have not altered the end result.

 

That being said, with a new system and a new clock setup it is critical to adhere to the warnings about stability and system use. You may very well find that even after every temp/load test has PASSED that the addition of PCIe 3D render loads MAY display minor stability issues... case in point: http://www.simforums.com/forums/bsod-when-flyinghow-bad-is-that_topic47467.html

 

 

REAL WORLD USE SYSTEM CLOCK RELATED CRASHES:

With a new system and new clock setup established if you find during render or other real world use that stability issues exist, (BSOD, CTD, lockups that you have confirmed are clock related) then small increases to Vcore (CPU VOLTAGE) or System Agent (VCCSA) may need to be applied. This is the final step to establishing a stable clock setup. Add a minor increase to Vcore and/or System Agent offset and then fly it again.

Many may never see any issues at all, most wont, but please if you see no issues right away DO NOT ASSUME stability. You have a test factor of 'time' that must pass before that assumption becomes valid.
 
 
OPTIONAL: If you wish to run extended time OCCT:CPU load tests on your system (a day or more without stopping) you can opt to do that. Simply set OCCT:CPU to run in 'INFINITE" mode instead of automatically timed for 1hr. Running such extended tests can provide a higher probability in system stability. I will sometimes run a 24hr load test, not always, but sometimes do that myself. If failures are seen then the same process that was outlined in the thread above for each clock speed outline is used to trim in long term stability. Usually a simple bump in Vcore or VCCSA does the trick.

Even with success in extended CPU/memory load tests you must remember that the addition of PCIe loads can still display minor lapses in stability which is why it is very important to not assume system stability until the system has been used for 3D render over several weeks without any signs of clock issues.

 

 

So please do remember that until your system has been tested in combat over a reasonable period of time you should avoid performing very large installations and major maintenance while clocked. This is why I outlined that all software be installed and that all maintenance is performed prior to beginning a clocking session and system use. During the initial test period if maintenance needs to be performed use your 'save BIOS' profile system to switch back and forth. Once you get past the initial testing period then you may work with the system as you normally would but in the clocked state.

Best,
Don

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Driver170 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-22-2021 at 4:33am
Hi,

Thanks for that Don. It has now been a full week of flight simming and no crashes just butter smooth performance. Am i stable? Of course not and i understand this now.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NickN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-22-2021 at 1:34pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Driver170 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-22-2021 at 2:12pm
Love a bit of bacon haha
W10 Home, 10900K, ROG Maximus XII Hero, EVGA RTX 3080ti, GSkill Memory DIMM 32 GB DDR4-3600 Quad-Kit, Corsair Hydro Series iCUE H150i PRO XT, Fractal Design Define 7 Mid-Tower Case
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NickN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August-22-2021 at 2:29pm


I prefer Green Eggs and Ham



Dr. Seuss Classics such as...  







and my favorite...






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